Panel: "Contexts and Perceptions in Turkey-Europe Cultural Relations - II"

Moderator: Serhan ADA, İstanbul Bilgi University, Performing Arts Management Program Coordinator, Turkey
Eddy TERSTALL- Film Director, Political Scientist, Holland
Serra YILMAZ- Actress, Turkey-Italy
Prof. Manuel COSTA LOBO- Urban Planning Consultant, President of Portuguese Urban Planners Association, Portugal



Serhan ADA- “Contexts and Perceptions in Turkey-Europe Relations”… I think it would be more proper to put all this in the singular form. As you can see, one of our speakers is absent; Gögün Taner is not here with us. He had to attend a live TV broadcast; he will come if he can make it on time. On the occasion of my being assigned the function of a moderator, I will infringe upon my duty and say a few things before introducing our participants. My presence here is probably due to the fact that I am the Director of the Bilgi University and the Coordinator of the project we are hoping to realize in 2006. This project is a project of transforming the Silahtaragha Energy Central, which has been active from 1911 till 1983 on the extreme end of the Golden Horn, into a cultural complex, in other words a project of transforming that energy into culture. It will comprise not only a Museum of Contemporary Art and an Energy Museum, but also a very big library and an international residence program. We hope that it will even house guests we have here today, and enable them to realize their projects and works. We also hope that it will constitute a new cultural space where many students will think on culture and participate actively in the cultural life on that side of Istanbul as well. I could perhaps begin by saying that; we hope that İstanbul will become a space which can exhibit the synergy it forms and the mutual sharing with both Europe and other places beyond, of course with the whole of the Balkans, Caucasia, the Middle East and Russia with a novel bid and a new approach. That’s why I wish to announce you the title of our project which we share with you here for the first time: “santralistanbull”.

After this session of exploitation, we will try to deal with the issues of perception and context. I’d like to introduce our guests: Eddy Terstall is a film director and a political scientist. Here, he will combine both fields to talk to you about European identity and identity in art. Beside him, there is Manuel Costa Lobo who is an urban planner and a speaker who has lectured and published works on the link between city and culture. He also served as an ombudsman in Lisboa, which will interest those of you here who reflect on culture and city and he has important studies on the transformation of urban spaces culturally. The other speaker is the actress and translator Serra Yılmaz.

I’d like to add one more thing before we start. If I’m not mistaken, Jose Maria Barroso, head of the EU, said as he took over the office that the time of culture had come. For us, the time of culture was long come, but perhaps for them the right time was now. At this point, perception and context will have a great importance. If you please, let us start with Eddy.



Eddy TERSTALL- Good afternoon. I would be ashamed that this is my first time in Turkey, even though it is three hours flying time from my city. There is not enough time to get an overall impression but the good thing about it is that like three days ago I was in New York where my latest film had his international premiere and because I want to speak about European identity in art or in my case in cinema because that’s the subject matter that I know most of. It’s good to make comparison between two societies. It’s hard but, somewhat I wanted to find a common denominator of what European identity is all about. After spending two weeks in New York, sometimes you wonder if the only difference is that the Americans go to see baseball in New York Yankees and that in Europe when you’re in Norway, Portugal or Turkey, everybody knows about European Champions League. In Amsterdam I think half of the population knows what Fenerbahçe and Galatasaray are and in America they think that Amsterdam is in Turkey. Well in this short quest for what European identity in art is, I think you have to look in a wider perspective. Even though I feel a lot of things in common -like the American spirit and stuff like that, you know the sense of freedom etc- I still think that Americans are more inclined than Europeans to see things in terms of commodity. Their form of capitalism is less self mockery and what Europeans in general aim for is, capitalism with self mockery.

One point I try to make a comedy about this subject; it was called “Rent a Friend”. I took the most intimate thing that a human has, which is friendship and used it as a commodity and in this film an artist can be rented as a friend. And the company became very successful because after a while you can rent ten friends for a party or even thirty for a reunion and it becomes a status symbol to rent friends. Reason that I tell you this is that later on I will tell you how this is related to the overall subject matter. For instance, when I make a film, I write a script how that comes about, how that originates. Because usually in not “formula based” (if you look at film as a commodity it’s usually formula based because you are looking at a certain audience, you have certain elements that you think might be commercial or might be effective) proper author cinema the filmmaker is also the writer of the screenplay usually. I think the way to go above is that first of all you have to think what is occupying you, what provokes passion in you, if the subject matter is in society, in human spirit or in the present situation in your country or in your city that really wants you to spend a year working on something about that.

Second step is that: what is your opinion about it, what do you think about this subject, is there something important that you have to tell. And the third step is the form. At that point it can still be book, sculpture, but in my case it is a film and usually my style of film. For me that’s always the proper step to take to come to something that is genuine, and in that stage I’m thinking of the audience. I know that things that I make are quite accessible; there is no reason from my point of view to think about the audience because it is going to be accessible anyway, but in terms of integrity I try for myself never to think of the effect on the audience.

If we take it one step back; I sometimes teach or used to teach at film academy. When some of my students are writing a screenplay, I try to help them to do the same way. Start with what occupies them, then what they think about it, what’s their opinion, then starting to write the story. So they can always gage their initial point every step of the way. Sometimes it happens that one of the students has a story that “the color of blue is beautiful” should be the final statement. But sometimes, along the half way down the story, you think of a twist, that the audience doesn’t expect and that works better. But the only result or the negative effect of that is, for instance the answer or the final statement would be that “Green is beautiful, not blue”. If I try to point it out to that student, he says ‘Yes, but it works better”. And we came to the point that; well are you a filmmaker because you want to be a filmmaker with everything involved, thus seeing all your carrier as commodity, or do you want to be a storyteller, be just a transition valve for a story that comes to you. And I think the influence of Hollywood Cinema in Holland is quite dominant, even the financing structure of Dutch films is based on formula films, because it works, it’s commodity but it is not something that is inherently European. The better European films and the films that make it to the International Film Festivals usually are author films, they are not based on formula. In fact formula and originality are quite the contrary; it’s usually original not formula based films that travel well also. Like Danish, Finnish, Portuguese or Greek films that make it to other countries are usually films that are not formula based. But having said that, looking upon art as commodity is overall present because you know, after all we live in an economy that has not enough self mockery even though it’s something that we as Europeans try to strive after Shroeder and Blair are talking about the third way, the capitalism that still preserves the essential freedoms or the essential values.

And the little quest of what is European identity, I can only speak for my own experience as a filmmaker: the filmmakers wherever you meet them, in festivals or from Iceland, Turkey or Spain usually have that attitude about filmmaking, when you run into filmmakers across the Atlantic, even Canadian are usually talking about what formula, what kind of film they’re making. That’s basically my short speech.

Serhan ADA- Yes, if Görgün Taner was here, he would probably talk about the actions of the Istanbul Foundation for Culture and Art, about Berlin, Brussels and maybe about the exposition in London about Turks and how that experience contributes to our frame of study. I think he still will join if he can. Even if Eddy gives us the impression that he looks through a camera lens, I would like to thank him for his presentation on perception and story-telling. Serra Yılmaz is a personality who is here and there at the same time. I use this double locality allusion on purpose... She has been in art circles, she has made successful productions. I think she has a word to say on “perception”.



Serra YILMAZ – Yes, like most of you know, Ignorant Fairies and The Opposite Window that followed Harem Suare, my first working experience with Ferzan Özpetek in 1998, are Italian films. Although the Turkish media usually prefers to present these films as Turkish films claiming that Turkish cinema has made great progress and has great success abroad, they are not Turkish films. These films were really greeted with great enthusiasm in Italy and have been watched by a large audience. Accordingly, they also determined my destiny in Italy and since then I started to work more often in there. My experience of cultural exchange up to that date was based on the function I assumed for a longtime at the Municipal Theater of Istanbul as a foreign relations manager. There is a problem we generally face when we talk about cultural exchange: from whatever country we seek contact with, we manage to import artists. For example, a director comes from France and stages the play of a contemporary French playwright on our scenes. But the other part of the “exchange” usually does not take place. This is due to several reasons pertaining to their cultural policies and our lack of cultural policies.

I would rather like to talk to you about more pragmatic things. Especially in the last years, despite myself I reluctantly assumed the role of a cultural delegate in Italy because The Opposite Window for example earned a considerable amount of box-office gross. To such an extent that, when broadcasted one month ago, its rating topped that of the most popular television series and game shows such as “Who wants to be a millionaire?” and was watched a second time on the TV screen by some 30 million spectators from all around Italy. As I said before, this gives me the mission of a Turkish cultural envoy against my will. This does have positive aspects, but sometimes it can become annoying. But while we are talking about perception, I would like to mention perception as witnessed while talking with the man on the street or on a TV program.

Sadly enough, we are the children of a State which never wanted to be recognized through its art and culture. That’s why in Europe -in particular in the two countries I spend most of my time, i.e. Italy and France- the first things that come to the mind about Turkey are the Turkish delight, belly-dancing, shish-kebab, and doner kebab which has proliferated far beyond Turkish limits. This is the kind of perception we are facing. A good part of the negative images comes from political troubles such as the Kurdish and Armenian problems. As far as Italy is concerned, the old “Mamma ‘li turchi” and yet again “The Battle of Lepanto” are still topical. I want to stress this in particular that those who stop me on the street are rarely concerned with my nationality. Things like this do happen occasionally; once a middle-aged woman stopped me and said: “I have seen you in many movies… but I can’t figure out clearly where you’re from.” I said “I’m Turkish”. She replied, “Ah nevermind, I’m from Sicily myself”. So, as a result of the similarity between our image of the East and the vision of the South in Italy, she kind of excused me for being Turkish.

But for example in December before the decision of the EU on the 17th of December, the extreme right-wing and nationalist Italian political party called the Northern League which is also a coalition member of the Berlusconi government organized a huge demonstration against the accession of Turkey to the EU and their slogans were, as I mentioned above, “Mamma ‘li turchi” and “The Battle of Lepanto”. Just after this demonstration the Repubblica newspaper asked me and Ferzan Özpetek what we thought about the issue. In the two days following the demonstration I was obliged to be present all by myself at a high-rating political television debate called Ballarò. As I said before, although I was quite annoyed about having assumed this mission, I did feel the obligation to do so against my will. There too, among the issues mentioned were how much drink Turks consumed, how much they slaughtered, killed and massacred. A unionist and a green socialist Deputy, made many statements without my needing to take the floor to speak and as far as I could see, this broadcast became something which deeply affected Italian public opinion. For in the days following the show and since December, many people have come up to me to say “Thank you very much, you gave the League deputy the answer he deserved”. Of course, such things happen also.

There is one other thing I stand for; we already talked about it in the first part of the Forum. We constantly talk about tolerance. As far as I’m concerned, I’m totally against tolerance, for if I have to tolerate something, it immediately means that that thing is faulty. Therefore, instead of talking about tolerance, I prefer to talk about respect. In effect, that night the League Deputy said, “Yes, perhaps you are more tolerant towards other religions”, I felt obliged to reply “No, we are not tolerant, we are perhaps more used to living with each other and I cannot possibly tolerate another religion for it is not my job to pronounce a judgment on the existence of a religion. All I can do is respect that religion and expect respect in return for my irreligion”. So this “living in tolerance” is far from being something I would be in favor of.

Now I would like to come back to what I was saying a few minutes ago. I think that besides all the changes we have to operate in our legislation and all the reforms we have to endorse within the process of accession to the EU – the future results of which we are totally uncertain- there is the mission of a cultural exchange that we have to undertake seriously in each level and to this effect, the State should allot a significant amount of money and further its support. For example, one thing I could never accept as a Turkish citizen is that, while hooligans traveling abroad to support their team are exempted from travel taxes which are moreover totally against the right of free circulation, these taxes are still levied from educational staff and artists leaving Turkey to attend cultural activities. The levying of this tax is against the European legislation at any rate.

In conclusion, I think that we should compel the State slightly in this direction together with our universities and cultural institutions. For even minor efforts can have a major effect on the way in which Turkey is perceived. For example, this winter I acted in a play in Florence. This play was a collage that the director created for me personally. In this collage there were the Arabian Nights stories, and the last night in the Harem was staged and two stories by Nazlı Eray were put together. This play made many people say “I want to go to Turkey again” or “I want to go discover Turkey” after hearing what was said about women but you know how drama affects only a small audience. However, these events I mentioned are a result of everyday life intersections. I have never been given support for what I have done by any institution whatsoever. It happened just because I was appreciated in Italy and owing to a director’s proposal. I think that in this sense, a cultural exchange has to be bilateral and not unilateral. If a foreign director is able to put on a play in Turkey, our actors and directors should have the same opportunity in that director’s country. I think that we really need to move in this direction. In my sense, it is through culture and art that we can best show them who we are. For that reason, as in a short story by Boris Vian, our State should give up the attitude: “I draw out my gun whenever they speak of culture”.

Serhan ADA- In the time left, you can ask the questions you were not able to ask during the previous session. If you are not bored of course. Perceptions alter in line with artworks and cultural productions. Given that Serra Yılmaz has mentioned Lepanto, I would like to remind you of a little chapter. We all know Cervantes for his Don Quixote. Cervantes also has a “Grande Sultana”, i.e. “the Great Khanim Sultan”, a play based on the story of a Khanim Sultan who has been able to cease the opposition in the Imperial Court with the Sultan’s force and thus maintained her religion, costumes and culture. What a marvelous product of Europe it would have been… if it were not for the impediments in the way of our perceiving one another. I need not mention here that Cervantes lost his left arm during the Battle of Lepanto and that he wrote the works of literature we know of with his right arm. Now, once more Manuel Costa Lobo will talk to us about the frame of perception partially by a study of kneading the materials that came up this morning.



Manuel COSTA LOBO- Thank you very much. I’m very happy to be here. I’m very grateful for every people that were presenting his ideas about Turkey and perception. I’m learning very much. And I’m trying to think with you. This is not a speech that I brought from Portugal; it’s a kind of ongoing thinking with you about this problem.

This is a way of presenting my message, first of all about culture and how we see the world around us; don’t forget that each one of us is always in the center of the world. We see from us, therefore all that we see is the circle around us. And when we come to the problem of Europe, I normally represent Europe as a triangle, this triangle has three very strategic, very important corners, where on the top corner, North Cape in Norway, then there are two very important corners downstairs; it is İstanbul and Lisbon. I came from Lisbon, but it is not because I came from Lisbon that Lisbon is there. I am a city planner, regional planner, and then I always think that things start by space. Therefore Europe is a space, it is this triangle. But don’t mix with European Union; EU is a political organization, Europe is a space. It was always like that, even EU was so little, Europe was still there. And I can see that from these corners, we can start a discussion about what happens to Turkey.

Very often I speak about Portugal; it is because I come from Portugal, but also because it is exactly the other extreme of this Southern Europe. If we go on, you can see that we have two stakes in Europe: one of the stakes is Anatolia, and the other one is the Iberian Peninsula. This is only geography, this is not very elaborated reasoning, but it is interesting to see that we can find here a very important political town; it is Ankara, the capital of the Turkish Republic. And on the other side is also a very important town; this is not the capital of Portugal, but the most important city in the Iberian Peninsula; it is Madrid. Here we have two countries Spain and Portugal, but we have to accept that Madrid is the most important city in this Peninsula. And both of them are in the middle of these spaces. This is because they are taking profit of all the surroundings. Madrid and Ankara are very new cities, but there are also very old and very important cities of these spaces.

In my point of view the biggest, important, fantastic and marvelous city in this space is Istanbul. And on the other side it is Lisbon, and Lisbon is the starting point of the big adventure of the world of Europe, it was the idea of going around Africa to this side. Because Istanbul was very near, Turkey was already on that side of Asia, because finally to make trade is very often the motor of progress. At that time, around the 15th century, the important thing in trade was to have a contact with Asia; silk, jewels, spices, and all those things. Turkey, İstanbul was near, but the Western Europe was very far. And there were fightings between these two sides, very often compared with two brothers; when there is the father, the medieval king then two brothers start fighting, killing the other if necessary to become the next king. We were fighting, it’s normal at that time, not now.

Then about this link between this Peninsula, minor Asia, not Asia, this is very important because this is the root of the understanding of people. But in any case there is a line that is the Bosphorus that cuts this space in two parts; what we call Europe, what we call Asia or better, minor Asia. But as a matter of fact the Bosphorus is not a real division, but mainly a great link. You can see how many boats are going from one side to another. And the metropolitan area of Istanbul is not only one side, therefore, even though we accept that division from the geographical point of view, it is a big connection; from the human, from the city, from the regional point of view this division doesn’t exist. This is the main link between these two parts.

Then I cannot speak about relations between Turkish culture and European culture because in my point of view, Turkey is in Europe, but I can speak about Turkey and EU, yes this I can speak about. In any case if EU is represented here with its culture, with its capacity, and Turkey is here, maybe there is really a gap. But the people from EU say “Well, please Turkey now you have to change your culture in order to come together”. Why? Why the Europeans don’t change? Maybe because this is radical but I am not radical. Maybe we have to find something between. Because in my point of view, if we look to Europe, the biggest soul of Europe came from downstairs, from Mediterranean. And if you have to see something as European, let us compare with the South of Europe, we can compare with Finland. From the cultural point of view, very big, very heavy, very ancient culture is down there. From political point of view there are many things to say….

Now another one; I’m speaking about education and knowledge. It’s interesting that we have north and south of Europe, it is very symbolic to get some polemics, and then we have the western and the eastern part of Europe. And from education and knowledge, here in the western part I must tell you that, we know a lot about the North Europe, we know a little about the Southern Europe, but the Eastern Europe, for many time was put very much out of the knowledge of people, a certain obscurity. Maybe we can say that it is because of the religion. Maybe it was, but religion was in my point of view manipulated by trade and by the economic interests. Therefore this side is not very known by most people in the western countries. Even today, the knowledge about Turkey is not enough, very far from being enough. I’m bringing many people here, the first time I came here was forty years ago, since then each time I bring people from Portugal, they come and say “I didn’t expect that Turkey was a country like that.” I don’t know what they thought but they were very astonished.

For me Europe is a space, we can say the EU is that, it could be but it is a problem of decision. We can go further but suddenly I am afraid that if we make all Europe like that and this little bit is not there, this triangle of Europe you see will be like that, without this part, it will be just destroying this space.

Here this is another symbolic scheme. This is the scheme representing Europe. But more or less the lines are corresponding to the links, to the distances; therefore you have little distance from the North. But from the distance point of view Lisbon and Istanbul are very far. Now let’s see from the cultural, mentality, behavior, capacity of getting friends aspects, and then Istanbul becomes very near to Lisbon. It is so easy to make friends here. We think that we are very similar from the image point of view, even the image of Turkish people having dark skin, very big mustache; in former times in Portugal, it was the same idea; Portuguese must be short, have a dark skin and a mustache. Therefore I think we are similar. Why? Because for centuries, for thousands of years the links trough Mediterranean were much easier. Since many many years ago, the link between Istanbul and Lisbon existed, even not Lisbon the south of Lisbon. We have found out very recently stones with Hitit writings, we are now trying to deal, maybe the Hitits were also there in Portugal. Phoenicians were coming very often to Portugal; we have settlements there.

When you are shaping Europe don‘t forget about this, then here I can put again Europe. And about trade, trade of culture; now some people speak about cultural industry. If these different countries, regions, peoples and cities all make business, and all have their production… And if we have to buy a very important thing we go to Germany or to Netherlands to buy, and these are the contacts that existed. It is competition, we have to compete; the price of “fındık” in Portugal is expensive, so I’m going to buy in Turkey. These countries are only competing to serve in good prices the northern Europe and north Europe is making business with South countries. I don’t like competition but I like the so-called “civilized competition”. I think human beings nowadays must not be anymore wild beasts, therefore we have to get through the wild competition, we have to do things in a civilized way. And again this means cooperation but the cooperation must come through culture, not only with economic alliances. Therefore you have to get cooperation in these countries. It seems their eyes are blind, they don’t notice the important links between ourselves. The southern countries must become able to cooperate and then we get a balance in Europe.

And the last one; about identity. To have identity and a good Europe, we need to get complementaries. Complementarities not only between South and North, but also between East and West, and here I represent a little bit of the history. When Ottoman Empire went around the world, getting more links, more countries, more territorial grounds, Portuguese could not do that, because in one side there was Spain which is much bigger and in the other side only fish. We could go to the sea, we could not have this kind of strategy, and the strategy was navigation; the globalization of the sea at that time. This is interesting that Portugal is still having a policy and capacities that bring us very far. There are many people who go to Mexico, or to Toronto, to Boston, to South of Africa; we have many relations that are spread out, we are not strong enough to have this kind of relations with our neighbors. But Turkey is strong enough to have all these relations with Balkan, Asian and Mesopotamian countries. Turkey is able to do that, and if Europe wants to have the best from each one of its partners, I think we can find here in Turkey and in Portugal completely different capacities, identities and complementaries. Therefore we have complementaries, we can have cooperation, we can be friends. Coming here very often with friends, also with students from Portugal, now they have very good friends. Some of them have already small kids. These kids are going to be born in families that already have friends on both sides. Thank you.

Serhan ADA- It is hard to add whatsoever after the presentation of Manuel Costa Lobo, because even if he may give the impression that he talked about cultural geography, he actually pronounced a poetica thereof. At any rate, that’s what could be awaited from a speaker coming from the same city with Pessoa. This problem of identity is a recurrent one. Nevertheless, I would like to add a small thing to make clear that the dimensions of this issue have little to do with geography as Costa Lobo claims, but that the space we call EU has a looser definition. Recently, we hosted a Greek scholar in our university department who was to lecture on economy and culture. He was talking about the things that took place in Greece. The major subject of discussion in the recent days was the fact that students of Albanian origin headed the procession holding the Greek flag during national ceremonies because they were the most diligent students of their classes and this created great problems for the Greek public opinion. Albania has nothing to do with our discussion, but it is a given fact that the presence of one million Albanian immigrants in the heart of Europe creates a grave frame of perception. Without giving further examples, I would like to return to the subject by telling you an anecdote. This is an anecdote between me and Oruç Aruoba, if he doesn’t mention it, I will. He doesn’t like to mention it when I do. Now that he has concluded his speech, I think I can transmit it. It concerns the question of what it means to be European and who is to be called European. While silently sitting amongst probably liberal statesmen, artists and intellectuals in one of the former Venetian Biennials, as people were looking for an answer to the question “Who is European?”, Borges raises his hand and says “I am the most European amongst you all”. We have come to the end of our presentation in the limits of the time given to us. Now, I’d like to turn to you to hear your questions and contributions. We may start.

Vassiliki PAPAKOSTOPOULOU- It’s my pleasure to be here in Istanbul. As you know, Turkey and Greece have good relationships. I work for the International Relations Department within the Hellenic Ministry of Culture and we had a friendly cooperation with Turkey within the framework of the Council of Europe, EU, UNESCO and other international organizations. Just to refer to your example of Albanian scene in Greece and the flag; the institutional framework in Greece is that the student who has the best grade in the class is honored with the Greek flag. So the constitution or the institutional framework gives the opportunity to the people coming from the other countries to share the culture. It is very important for us. Thank you very much to having the opportunity here, have a nice afternoon to you all.

Serhan ADA– Yes, we surely have many things to learn from our neighbours.

Nevin TAN- I’m an architect retired from the Iller Bank and the Urban Development Planning Directorate of Istanbul. I think that the theme mentioned by our Greek colleague can very well be applied to Turkey in the following sense: relating to the education, due to the fact that the western section of Turkey is supplied with fertile farmlands and fields, the farmers living in that region do not let their kids have an education because they prefer that their sons continue to cultivate those lands after them -here I’m rather talking about a prevalent case in the past which still continues. The best students are those kids which we formerly called Eastern now named as the Kurds. If we were to consider bureaucrats of higher ranks predominantly we see those Kurdish kids who have had a good education. Similarly the same goes fo the military, although due to the conjuncture, they prefer not to call themselves Kurds. I felt obliged to make the link between the two cases because I observed a similar situation in Greece. On the other hand, I have known Manuel Costo Lobo for a very long time. He has made many valuable contributions especially in the Mimar Sinan University concerning Turkey. Thanks to his background in architecture and urban planning, he has produced extremely interesting schemes very appropriate for sociopolitical structures even though they may seem stylized. Maybe today here these schemes are valid, but I think that they should also be developed and integrated in the other activities of the EU. I’d like to thank him specialy for that reason.

A listener- The term “European Culture” is recurrent. I’d like to ask this question to speakers coming from Europe: is there such a thing as a World culture? If yes, what is the difference between European culture and the World culture?

Eddy TERSTALL- I think that there is definitely such a thing as European culture in a sense that the level of spiritual, intellectual development has a lot to do with economic progress and also the level of secularity is usually interconnected. And I think because of the fact that we all, the Turks like the Portuguese and Dutch, have plundered the rest of the world for a long time we have this economical advantage which caused us to be more liberal and secular countries than most of the third world countries. And I think because this more liberal attitude brought about curiosity, freedom of thinking, invention and progress and therefore because of our stolen advantage, we took advantage of the rest of the world basically. Our liberal attitude has caused a more wider and a more open look on the world which usually result in a more secular and open society. And I think that this is more or less what European culture is. Even for instance when I was in New York, the New York cultural elite like to identify themselves very much with Europe, cause they look upon themselves as forwards compared to the rest of the country. They think that they, the New Yorkers and maybe the people also from the west coast are Europe oriented, and that the rest of the country is basically backward Christian peasants.

The same listener- So that’s European culture? What about the World culture? If I read something from Portugal, if I watch a movie from Jamaica, I feel it the same way, because not I’m Turkish or something else, I just feel it because I am a human being. But what about the culture, is there a world culture?

Eddy TERSTALL- There is a world culture but I think because of the openness and liberal achievement that we manage to get because of our economic advantage again that we basically have stolen centuries before. But we do have that economic advantage which led to an extent to less backwardness and less religious fundamentalism. So the fact of being so liberal and having more opportunities to think freely and to be curious, I think that leads to an overall culture which is more open minded, liberal and libertarian and I would like to say that this is the European culture, and I think that’s also the way that others, like intellectual elites from Kuala Lumpur to Brasil also identify it.

Manuel COSTA LOBO- I will try also to add something about culture. I think it will be really difficult to say what is especially in Europe that we could call European culture. But one thing is important. Europe is composed by many countries, regions and various high personalities, with many fights during thousand of years. But bit by bit we came more mature, now Europe is not interested in going on having fights between regions or countries, because this is old. If you go to America, Brazil, many countries, they are very big, they have their states but they have a kind of homogeneity, same language etc. Here we have so many little differences, and we have bit by bit trained to live within this diversity. And there is also the city planning, this aspect. I think that in a certain way, city planning has some European characteristics. For instance, we have a very nice concept about central area of the city; the forum, the agora or the things that came before us, but than all these came to the concept of central area. Central area is a place of getting together, city is a place for social integration. What we see for instance in American literature, they don’t speak about central area, they speak about cbd, central business distinct. It seems that we give more importance to culture. But in any case, I think what is important is that we have to get to understand each other and if religion is the reason for our fight then let the religion from the window.

I would like to answer about the question “Is there a world culture?”, because actually that wasn’t answered. I think what’s threatening to become world culture is what we call “Mc Culture”; what’s turning to become the world culture is the spread of American culture. And this really is something to be aware and weary of. I think the difference between the European culture and the Mc Culture or the world culture, coca-cola, jeans, MTV, any place you wanna go; Russia, India everybody try to look like a little American. The Europeans hopefully until now has been going to depths of meaning, looking actually for some kind of spirituality -whatever definition you want to give- against this consumer world that anyone is talking about, where everything has a price tag and you just sell whatever you can to anybody you can. I think this is where the European culture can really benefit from a marriage with a Muslim land, because what the Muslim people still have is spirituality. They’re still busy with some kind of moral values which we’re rapidly loosing. I think that can be their great contribution to our civilization.

Alican GÜZEL- Vienna, Meeting Point of Cultures Association. My question will be to Ms. Serra Yilmaz. As she said in her speech, although Turkey receives a lot of external support, there is nothing substantial she can give back. The examples that occur to me are the fact that the films she mentioned were Italian, that the films made by Fatih Akin, although entirely German, were presented in the press as Turkish films and that Turkey does not, cannot make a contribution herself. Well then, what should be the route to follow? What should be the next plan? Now, after the 17th of December, since “the time of culture has come” as cited by the EU president, what should be the contributions of Turkey? How should she support the artists living abroad?

Serra YILMAZ– What I wish to make clear is this: it is the production company that determines the nationality of films, not the directors. All journalists in Turkey who have come to me recently seem very optimistic. They say “Turkish cinema is making great improvements, isn’t it?” And this puzzles me. Now, Ferzan’s films are Italian, those of Fatih are German. However Nuri Bilge Ceylan is a very atypical director for he himself writes his scenarios, produces his films himself, shoots it himself, his family acts in his films and therefore they are not films made with a production budget. That’s what I tried to point out. If you ask what should be done, Turkey has to build up its own film industry; you should not forget that in the past we used to produce much more films. Nowadays we cannot even make 20 films per year. Of course, the State has to make a contribution for the establishment of this industry. We pay so many taxes to the government that it is hard to understand why these taxes never return to us as a support to the Turkish cinema instead of guns and weapons, that’s what I’m asking myself…

Alican GÜZEL– I’ll add a small thing. We also do drama work in Vienna; we do Turkish drama pieces. It is quite an odd situation; we act pieces in Turkish, but receive no support from Turkey. We do them with the help of the Austrian government and the Municipality. Now Turkey will have to produce projects in Arabic and Kurdish. How is Turkey going to face this situation then?

Serra YILMAZ– By having a cultural policy. Is it not the raison d’être of the Ministry of Culture?

Serhan ADA– Although it’s not up to me to talk in the name of the Ministry of Culture, I think it is necessary to tell you something I witnessed in Ankara recently. The Ministry of Culture is at the stage of preparing Turkey’s cultural policy to present it to the EU and they are seeking how to share it with civil society organizations. I don’t know if we should consider this to be good news, but this project exists and it will be presented to the EU. But personally I do not advocate a close cooperation with the government in these kind of things, for sometimes metaphorically “playing together” does not give good results, either the game is interrupted or the toy gets broken. I see that there is another question over there…

Serra YILMAZ- Pardon me, I’d like to add a little thing. To play closely with the state does not mean to be supervised by it. When the state supports a film, it certainly does not have the right to censor it afterwards by saying that it is a good film, a bad film or that it is not a good representation or that it talks about the story of small Kurdish girl.

Aliye KURUMLU- Ms. Yilmaz made the following observation: we easily invite foreign guests and artists to Turkey but it is very hard for us to go abroad, to Europe or elsewhere in the world. What can be done in this respect? It is a vast subject, but she could express herself in a few words.

Serra YILMAZ- Let me say this much: when we look at the way in which these exchanges take place, we realize that most European countries have cultural centers in our country. The people working in these cultural centers work to bring together people working in cultural domains in their country with those of Turkey. I will again give an example from France: besides the AFAA Bureau which is subordinated to the Ministry of Foreign Affairs, there is a publication office charged with the presentation of the French culture and this office supports the translation of French works published worldwide. The other day, I was a jury member in a film festival in Italy. A number of feminist groups came up to me and asked: “Are there not any woman writers in Turkey?” They are in great number, “But we don’t know any of them.” They don’t know them because publishers do not make any efforts to look for writers they don’t know of from countries they don’t know of to publish their works because they can’t always draw a great profit from bookselling. But apparently our Ministry of Culture has begun to give a certain support, I ignore what it amounts to. If such a support exists, you could propose a project. Apart from this, something like a cultural center could be created, there can be a cultural attaché and the director of the cultural center, the attaché or the manager -howsoever we may call him- can cease to be the brother-in-law or the nephew of the Minister and can be someone to really execute his functions. For as far as I could see, the list of government officials was satiated in this way. I think these should really be done.

Nelson FERNANDEZ- Visiting Arts UK. This is an answer to the previous question concerning how to present the art of Turkey. I think accidentally this is an issue that is of interest of all artists in the EU, if any consolation, it is not only a question that arises only with Turkish artists looking to present their work elsewhere in the EU. But there are mechanisms; I work for an organization that is called Visiting Arts, which is a sister organization to the British Council. I know that as one of your panelists has already identified, for example in France there are similar mechanisms. There is a growing sense in Europe in order to really have a dialogue, you have to not only present the arts of your country, but you need to also encourage the presentation of the arts of other countries in your own, so as to really allow your public, your audiences to understand what is the art and culture of the rest of our brothers and sisters on the EU is about. For example Visiting Arts, supports and encourages the presentation of foreign arts in the UK by providing access to the information, by providing access to networks, by providing artists with information about producers, curators, promoters, festivals that may be interested in the work. And I think this is something that is happening more and more throughout the EU, and that is something that anybody has questions about presenting work in Britain, than I would be happy to find an answer to some of these questions. And I think that we all need to encourage our Ministry of Culture to be more open and receptive, allowing and encouraging artists and companies to freely exchange by providing financial support, which is sometimes very difficult for ministries to accept. I am happy to answer questions later, if anybody wants to know more about how to present in the UK. Thank you.

Eddy TERSTALL- I’ll give you a relatively good example about how to promote your own culture in foreign countries. Five or six years ago, the Dutch government when it was like a state visit, they used to give a painting or something like that. But they stopped doing that. Now they give a state gift, very usual state gift lately for the last five years is to give a Dutch Film Week, to the country that the queen or the Prime Minister visits, because it is a more accessible way to reach a foreign audience. That is for instance a very nice way to show your culture. I think that was a very good idea, because usually those events are well attended by the country that the Prime Minister or any minister visits. I think it’s a better idea for instance to give a Theatre or Film Week as a state gift, than something less accessible.

Serhan ADA- Before moving on to the last question, I’d like to thank the speakers for having created an environment so much open to discussion. With your permission, I would like to take the last question so that we finish on time.

Genco GÜLAN – First of all, I’d like to say that I find the issue of national representation rather dangerous both in the case of Turkey’s representation and the representation of foreign countries in Turkey. I have serious doubts about the representation of culture solely through nationalistic values. In addition to this, I would like to make a small contribution to the previous discussion. The former Minister of Culture Mr. Erkan Mumcu had said: “Plenty of money, projects wanting”.